Mana Kobayashi (Design Office Ima) Interviewer: Ikuko Kato (Spiral Curator)
Spiral is dedicated to the promotion of ‘the fusion of life and art’. Our work includes both exhibitions that open the door to the world of art, and presenting objects of ‘daily art’ whose presence in our living spaces touch our hearts with the joy they bring to our everyday. On this occasion, we put the spotlight on the latter and visited the office and home of Design Office Ima’s Mana Kobayashi. Ms Kobayashi surrounds herself with works purchased at Spiral by textile designer and potter Fujiwo Ishimoto and artist Miyako Yamazaki, among others. Spiral Curator Ikuko Kato asked her about all kinds of things from her first encounters with art, to how we might enjoy art in daily life.
Kato: You graduated from a fine arts university and now work as an interior designer, so I suspect your network includes many artists. What is your motivation for purchasing objects of art?
Kobayashi: I’ve always loved art and often went to art exhibitions. One day, it dawned on me that you can purchase works of art at these exhibitions. I’d bought posters and editioned works, but the first real work of art I purchased was by Fujiwo Ishimoto. I went to see his exhibition at a gallery in Shirogane in 2007 and bought a leaf-shaped ceramic tile.
Kato: I went to that exhibition, too. At the time, he was making many abstract black square objects, wasn’t he?
Kobayashi: His flower ceramic tiles began emerging then also. Initially, I tried to match objects with the room and chose items in monochrome tones. I suppose I should have chosen one of Ishimoto-san’s bright floral works, but I already had marimekko covers and quite a lot of other colored items, so I chose black and white objects – things in more subdued tones.
Kato: Was that exhibition after you’d already done the work for marimekko at Spiral?
Kobayashi: Yes. We did the venue set-up for the marimekko exhibition in 2005, and that’s where it all began. In 2006, we did the interior design for marimekko OMOTESANDO – the brand’s first store in Japan. You know, when I first met Ishimoto-san at the marimekko office and again when I met him at the Spiral exhibition, he was incredibly brusque (laughs). Only after I met him again by chance in 2015 at the airport on my way to Helsinki to design some overseas store locations, did we become great friends. He very kindly showed me where the change machine was, and it was then that he also invited me to his home.
Kato: I think I first met Ishimoto-san in 2006. One of our Spiral exhibitions went on tour to the Finland Design Museum and the exhibiting artist undertook a residency in the Arabian art department. Ishimoto-san was there so I expressed my hope that he would do an exhibition at Spiral someday, but I certainly got the impression that he was shy. Then in 2010, we had a solo exhibition by him. Our records show that you purchased a white flower ceramic tile on that occasion.
Kobayashi: OK, so that was 2010. I then had the pleasure of doing the venue design for Fujiwo Ishimoto’s second solo exhibition at Spiral, in 2012.
Kato: That’s right – at Ishimoto-san’s suggestion. He said he really wanted Ima to design the space. In terms of works of art, I believe you also purchased a piece at Miyako Yamazaki’s Spiral exhibition last year. Did you hear about the exhibition through an invitation from Spiral?
Kobayashi: Yes, an invitation and Instagram. I didn’t know Miyako Yamazaki, but a lot of people were posting about the exhibition on Instagram, and I thought it looked wonderful. I loved the theme ‘future landscapes one thousand years from now’ and the photos of the sky were beautiful. I only purchased one piece, but I really wanted two or three. For a while it stood leaning against the wall.
Kato: I would like to hear a little more about when you first purchased a work of art. What kind of impression or recollections do you have from that moment?
Kobayashi: At the exhibition, it was placed in the entrance and seemed to make the whole space so cheerful. When it arrived at my home, I was so surprised by the size of it! I was seriously thinking – what is this? (laughs). These kinds of objects truly make a home. I really felt it was so lovely.
Kato: Once you’ve bought one object and decorated it in your home, the next time you go to an exhibition do you think ‘maybe I should buy something’, or does your thinking change in some way?
Kobayashi: That is exactly what happens. It’s quite a big outlay, but you have something to show for it. In the beginning, my husband and I would discuss and choose something together, but somewhere along the way we realized that it makes more sense for us to each choose what we like. We would go to exhibitions together but purchase different artworks, so we have two or three objects from the same artist in our home. For example, the two Ronan Bouroullec works in the hallway – I chose the one on the right and my husband chose the one on the left. It is the same with the 2 Mitsuru Koga pieces upstairs. I don’t always buy a piece when visiting exhibitions, but often my preferences align with my husband’s.
Kato: You mentioned that you often visit exhibitions, but do you go for certain styles, techniques, or genres? I feel that Ishimoto-san’s work straddles design and art, but for you is it less about genre and more about buying a work of art that you like?
Kobayashi: Our buying decisions are based purely on whether we like something. I have always loved contemporary art, visiting the Yokohama Triennale and making special trips to Europe every ten years, in 1997, 2007 and 2017, when ‘documenta’, ‘Sculpture Projects Münster’ and ‘Venice Biennale’ all overlap. Now more than anything I want the ‘City’ series by Mike Kelley, but there is no way I can buy that (laughs).
Kato: You mentioned you bought Ishimoto-san’s piece at a commercial gallery, but where do you buy conceptual art and other works of ‘fine art’? Do you also often visit art galleries?
Kobayashi: I hardly ever go to art galleries, but I like CURATOR’S CUBE. It has that crossover between design, art and handicraft. This item here I bought at Kazuto Kobayashi’s OUTBOUND – call it art or call it craft, either way it really draws you in.
Kato: It’s so important to buy what you really want. It’s that sense that you want a certain artist’s work to be a part of your life. When it comes to contemporary art, I think many people feel intimidated. They worry too much about knowledge and understanding the context of a piece, or that they must feel a certain way about it.
Kobayashi: After I graduated from university, I thought I wanted to help out on Jan Hoet’s project ‘Ripple Across the Water’. I went along to a volunteer information session, but I had utterly no idea what they were talking about (laughs). It made me think that if that is what contemporary art is all about, I’m best to just look at it from a distance. I don’t try too hard, and if there’s something that I like or that appeals to me, I go and take a look, and I buy pieces if they’re for sale.
Kato: You spoke earlier about buying pieces of art in more subdued tones because you have plenty of color from marimekko fabrics. Are you thinking about your overall collection, or the interior design of your home when you make purchases?
Kobayashi: Currently, I don’t have many marimekko fabrics. When we built our house, we made it extremely simple from floor to ceiling, like a white box, so that any item that came in would be unobtrusive. We have works of art in a glass cabinet upstairs which we only switch over once or twice a year, and it feels just right. I never grow bored. When we first moved here in 2016, I filled the cabinet with objects, but after changing it two or three times I spread the objects out a bit more and found I really loved it that way. Recently, I’ve been choosing a geometric theme or a certain material like glass, timber, stone, or brick when I arrange objects in the case.
Kato: You’re like a curator for an exhibition. What was the motivation for creating more blank space inside the cabinet?
Kobayashi: I’ve been searching for more elbowroom in general recently. The table outside used to be in the living room where we are right now, but I always felt it was a little too big for this space. With the pandemic, not many guests come over, so we parted ways with the Fritz Hansen table we had since we got married. We’re renovating some other rooms too, and I just feel like I want to pare back more and simplify.
Kato: You said you had the table since you were newlyweds. Do you tend to hold on to things for a long time?
Kobayashi: To be honest, I don’t switch things over much. I’m envious of people today who can refresh and renew, always selling things on free market apps. I pretty much threw everything out in a major decluttering exercise immediately after the 3-11 earthquake disaster. I didn’t know about those kinds of apps back then.
Kato: When you selected pieces for the Spiral art fair ‘spiral take art collection 2017: shu shu shu show’, I was fascinated with the balance you struck, choosing not only ceramic pieces by Makoto Kagoshima and textiles, but also items made from everyday materials like paper and wood. The same goes for Mitsuru Koga and Jenni Rope. Also enamel. is a favorite of mine too.
Kobayashi: enamel. is the one who makes clutch bags, right? I learned about them from DESPERADO. I also get hints from friends. I personally love things that I can start using straight away. I don’t want to store them – I want to get them out and use them as much as possible. They’re not necessarily for everyday use, but somewhat more casual items.
Kato: You have a dog and a cat, but that doesn’t stop you from having pieces around the house?
Kobayashi: We put the glass cabinet on the second floor to protect the pieces from the cat. We only have one cat now – a very docile one – but the two we had before were so naughty (laughs)!
Kato: And it’s not just about displaying pieces – you’re so good at wearing pieces and incorporating them into your daily life.
Kobayashi: Thank you. Yes, today I’m wearing a shirt printed with Shiro Kuramata’s terrazzo design. I thought it was perfect for today (laughs). And we use plates by Makoto Kagoshima whenever friends come over, so they’re getting chipped little by little. Looking at the price now, I could of course never use them if children came over (laughs). But Kagoshima-san himself says he wants people to use his pieces, and I think that’s the best way to incorporate them into your life.
Mana Kobayashi
Joint director of Design Office Ima with Takashi Kobayashi since 1998. They have worked on interior design and architecture for many commercial spaces. Their balanced designs skillfully weave together the functionality of storage space and flow lines with a colorful, cheerful atmosphere that can be applied both to private homes and commercial facilities. Design Office Ima have established a reputation for creating spaces that beautifully showcase the unique qualities of people and brands. Key works include the design of marimekko and IL BISONTE’s Japan stores.
Ikuko Kato
Joined Spiral/Wacoal Art Center after graduating with a Master’s degree from the University of Tokyo Graduate School of Humanities and Sociology. She worked in Spiral Garden then served as its chief and manager before taking her current role as Curator. Primarily engaged in the planning and production of contemporary art exhibitions, her work also includes new program development for Spiral. Some of the exhibitions she has organized include Takehito Koganezawa ‘Future of Smoke’ (2016), ‘Rhizomatiks 10’ (2017), the ‘Ascending Art Annual Series: Shapes and Figures’ (2017), ‘Matsuri, Matsuru’ (2018), and ‘Song to Life, Struggles of the Soul’ (2019).
Photo: Kazue Kawase
Interviews and text: Spiral Press
Forming Sustainable Partnerships with Creators The establishment of the new SICF section and the opening of +S Spiral Market Osaka
The Hidden Gems – Loose Ties Emerge Between Artists and Locales: Yoshie Ota (Spiral Curator) X Naoki Ishikawa (Photographer)
